I've just been on the phone to the HMRC since I received this morning
two revised tax notices for 6th April 2009 to 5th April 2010. These
new codes meant that I would have to pay 20% of tax on my private
pensions, but, as I pointed out to the HMRC, I do not receive income
in total that is more than my personal allowance (by far). My details
haven't changed in three years, either, yet the HMRC computer still
issued these revised tax codes to give it, wrongly, the benefit of 20%
tax.

The assistant checked my details through the computer and changed the
tax codes again,so that I no longer pay tax on these pensions, as has
been the case since 2006. When I asked the assistant how these errors
had occurred, she simply said, umming and ahhing, well, the computer
is supposed to calculate the codes automatically, but somehow it
failed this time.

Really ****es me off that they can get such a fundamental thing wrong.
Still, I suppose it's good that they work on Saturdays.

MM

"MM" wrote in message
...
I've just been on the phone to the HMRC since I received this morning
two revised tax notices for 6th April 2009 to 5th April 2010. These
new codes meant that I would have to pay 20% of tax on my private
pensions, but, as I pointed out to the HMRC, I do not receive income
in total that is more than my personal allowance (by far). My details
haven't changed in three years, either, yet the HMRC computer still
issued these revised tax codes to give it, wrongly, the benefit of 20%
tax.

The assistant checked my details through the computer and changed the
tax codes again,so that I no longer pay tax on these pensions, as has
been the case since 2006. When I asked the assistant how these errors
had occurred, she simply said, umming and ahhing, well, the computer
is supposed to calculate the codes automatically, but somehow it
failed this time.

Really ****es me off that they can get such a fundamental thing wrong.
Still, I suppose it's good that they work on Saturdays.

MM

a friends revised code said he owed tax on £12K unearned income from his
other employment when he has no other employment. Apparently HMRC added this
to other peoples codes as well.

In message , MM
writes
I've just been on the phone to the HMRC since I received this morning
two revised tax notices for 6th April 2009 to 5th April 2010. These
new codes meant that I would have to pay 20% of tax on my private
pensions, but, as I pointed out to the HMRC, I do not receive income
in total that is more than my personal allowance (by far). My details
haven't changed in three years, either, yet the HMRC computer still
issued these revised tax codes to give it, wrongly, the benefit of 20%
tax.

The assistant checked my details through the computer and changed the
tax codes again,so that I no longer pay tax on these pensions, as has
been the case since 2006. When I asked the assistant how these errors
had occurred, she simply said, umming and ahhing, well, the computer
is supposed to calculate the codes automatically, but somehow it
failed this time.

A friend who works in a tax office told me something similar, that tax
code calculations are now automated (computer says.....).
She also finds that some of the queries and transactions she now has to
deal with are above her level of training (increased complexity), and an
increasing number have to be escalated to a supervisor.
She has been doing the job for some years now, and is happy to be part
time, as they are expected to complete 170 transactions in an 8 hour
shift, which means less than three minutes on each case.
Every hour, they have to report their progress on a whiteboard.

Please don't tell anyone I told you. ;-)
--
Gordon H
Remove "invalid" to reply

Lez Pawl wrote:
"MM" wrote in message
...

I've just been on the phone to the HMRC since I received this morning
two revised tax notices for 6th April 2009 to 5th April 2010. These
new codes meant that I would have to pay 20% of tax on my private
pensions, but, as I pointed out to the HMRC, I do not receive income
in total that is more than my personal allowance (by far). My details
haven't changed in three years, either, yet the HMRC computer still
issued these revised tax codes to give it, wrongly, the benefit of
20% tax.

The assistant checked my details through the computer and changed the
tax codes again,so that I no longer pay tax on these pensions, as has
been the case since 2006. When I asked the assistant how these errors
had occurred, she simply said, umming and ahhing, well, the computer
is supposed to calculate the codes automatically, but somehow it
failed this time.

Really ****es me off that they can get such a fundamental thing
wrong. Still, I suppose it's good that they work on Saturdays.

MM

a friends revised code said he owed tax on £12K unearned income from
his other employment when he has no other employment. Apparently HMRC
added this to other peoples codes as well.

Having read this, I've returned again to the HMRC notification I recently
received.

It informed me that I owe tax on a sum of £532 which, although a
comparatively small amount to worry about, is impossible for me to
recognise.

They only reference this sum vaguely as being owed "from a previous tax
year" also adding "you may remember us telling you about this before". This
is absolutely the first I've heard of it though.

I was going to ignore it as trivial but I think I'll write now and ask them
to be more specific.

"John Burke" wrote in message
...
Lez Pawl wrote:
"MM" wrote in message
...

I've just been on the phone to the HMRC since I received this morning
two revised tax notices for 6th April 2009 to 5th April 2010. These
new codes meant that I would have to pay 20% of tax on my private
pensions, but, as I pointed out to the HMRC, I do not receive income
in total that is more than my personal allowance (by far). My details
haven't changed in three years, either, yet the HMRC computer still
issued these revised tax codes to give it, wrongly, the benefit of
20% tax.

The assistant checked my details through the computer and changed the
tax codes again,so that I no longer pay tax on these pensions, as has
been the case since 2006. When I asked the assistant how these errors
had occurred, she simply said, umming and ahhing, well, the computer
is supposed to calculate the codes automatically, but somehow it
failed this time.

Really ****es me off that they can get such a fundamental thing
wrong. Still, I suppose it's good that they work on Saturdays.

MM

a friends revised code said he owed tax on £12K unearned income from
his other employment when he has no other employment. Apparently HMRC
added this to other peoples codes as well.

Having read this, I've returned again to the HMRC notification I recently
received.

It informed me that I owe tax on a sum of £532 which, although a
comparatively small amount to worry about, is impossible for me to
recognise.

They only reference this sum vaguely as being owed "from a previous tax
year" also adding "you may remember us telling you about this before".
This
is absolutely the first I've heard of it though.

I was going to ignore it as trivial but I think I'll write now and ask
them
to be more specific.





someone has got to pay for all our troops overseas...

On Sat, 23 Jan 2010 11:14:27 +0000, MM wrote:

I've just been on the phone to the HMRC since I received this morning
two revised tax notices for 6th April 2009 to 5th April 2010. These
new codes meant that I would have to pay 20% of tax on my private
pensions, but, as I pointed out to the HMRC, I do not receive income
in total that is more than my personal allowance (by far). My details
haven't changed in three years, either, yet the HMRC computer still
issued these revised tax codes to give it, wrongly, the benefit of 20%
tax.

The assistant checked my details through the computer and changed the
tax codes again,so that I no longer pay tax on these pensions, as has
been the case since 2006. When I asked the assistant how these errors
had occurred, she simply said, umming and ahhing, well, the computer
is supposed to calculate the codes automatically, but somehow it
failed this time.

Really ****es me off that they can get such a fundamental thing wrong.
Still, I suppose it's good that they work on Saturdays.

MM

Ignore any coding notices from HMRC until near to the new tax year and
then, if the last coding notice you received is wrong, phone HMRC and
get them to correct it in time for your first pay day in 2010-2011.

Below are two messages from a respected tax expert:

"I posted a little while ago with a warning message. HMRC has already
warned us that there will be a shake out for this year only as a
result of the new computer system being in use for the first year, so
they predict possibly double the number of notices of coding and fully
expect quite a number to be wrong as the duff data received from
employers starts to get weeded out. Some members have already
expressed dismay, but in my view the new system has to start somewhere
and in warning the professional bodies and Working Together nice and
early, and provided they deploy enough staff to cope with it I think
they are on message here. We'll be carrying articles in February when
the TR's are done setting out things to look for and what HMRC
recommends should be done."

and

"How would you review and then issue 25 million notices of coding
before 5 April? Who would be able to do this without detailed
knowledge of each taxpayer's records - which each taxpayer has.

A lot of the duff info is in relation to P45's which have gone
walkabout so lots of people are getting notices in respect of jobs
they have left in the last couple of years. Now that P45's are online
this should flush out that aspect of it. HMRC's early message is to
sit tight for a bit and see whether any more come which correct the
position - hence in my view hang on until Feb and start then. There
will be articles on site on Monday 1 Feb with full details of what
action to take.

I don't dispute that this is frustrating and a potentially major
issue, but I also don't see any way of getting from where we were (no
tie up between employments for each person) and where we need to be
(whole taxpayer records) without some aggravation. HMRC's systems for
PAYE were as old as the ark and I for one am pleased that the
investment has gone in to completely redesign and rebuild from the
ground up. I do not think this is HMRC incompetence - nor do I think
it is done to deliberately wind up accountants. It just has to be done
and we have to get past it."

My response was as follows:

"This is NOT an acceptable way of dealing with the problem
If HMRC think the notices are likely to be wrong they should issue a
covering letter explaining the situation in detail. This should ask
taxpayers to review the notices and give the phone number of a
helpline to report any errors. Taxpayers think that anything from HMRC
must be correct and any error must be down to themselves or their
accountant. The notices don't admit the problems and I feel this is
unacceptable. It causes distress and worry to taxpayers and
demonstrates HMRCs cavalier attitude to taxpayers and agents."

Lez Pawl wrote:
"John Burke" wrote in message
...
Lez Pawl wrote:
"MM" wrote in message
...

I've just been on the phone to the HMRC since I received this
morning two revised tax notices for 6th April 2009 to 5th April
2010. These new codes meant that I would have to pay 20% of tax on
my private pensions, but, as I pointed out to the HMRC, I do not
receive income in total that is more than my personal allowance
(by far). My details haven't changed in three years, either, yet
the HMRC computer still issued these revised tax codes to give it,
wrongly, the benefit of 20% tax.

The assistant checked my details through the computer and changed
the tax codes again,so that I no longer pay tax on these pensions,
as has been the case since 2006. When I asked the assistant how
these errors had occurred, she simply said, umming and ahhing,
well, the computer is supposed to calculate the codes
automatically, but somehow it failed this time.

Really ****es me off that they can get such a fundamental thing
wrong. Still, I suppose it's good that they work on Saturdays.

MM

a friends revised code said he owed tax on £12K unearned income from
his other employment when he has no other employment. Apparently
HMRC added this to other peoples codes as well.

Having read this, I've returned again to the HMRC notification I
recently received.

It informed me that I owe tax on a sum of £532 which, although a
comparatively small amount to worry about, is impossible for me to
recognise.

They only reference this sum vaguely as being owed "from a previous
tax year" also adding "you may remember us telling you about this
before". This
is absolutely the first I've heard of it though.

I was going to ignore it as trivial but I think I'll write now and
ask them
to be more specific.

someone has got to pay for all our troops overseas...
someone has got to pay for all the banker's bonuses...

On Sat, 23 Jan 2010 18:36:08 +0000, Peter Saxton
wrote:

Ignore any coding notices from HMRC until near to the new tax year.....

I couldn't ignore them, for it would have meant that the pension
companies concerned would have started deducting 20% from next month.

Sure I can wait a year, then claim the overpaid tax back, but why
should I bail out the Treasury for the Government's mishandling of the
economy?

MM

On Sat, 23 Jan 2010 18:36:08 +0000, Peter Saxton
wrote:

My response was as follows:

"This is NOT an acceptable way of dealing with the problem

Neither do I.

If HMRC think the notices are likely to be wrong they should issue a
covering letter explaining the situation in detail. This should ask
taxpayers to review the notices and give the phone number of a
helpline to report any errors.

Well, in my case the timeline went roughly like this: Post arrived
earlier than usual (10:30) and this being a Saturday I was still in my
dressing gown eating my cornflakes. Amongst the other delights from
double-glazing companies, two letters from HMRC. Oh, I thought. How
nice of them to follow up last week's tax refund cheque with a couple
of congratulatory letters (you know, the ones where they say "We are
pleased to inform you....yada yada yada"). Imagine my consternation,
then, to open the letters to find revised tax coding notices that
suddenly gave the government 20% of my income when my income comes
nowhere near my personal allowance!

Up the stairs to where I keep my files, out with the "HMRC" one and
straight on to the phone. I was a bit surprised that they actually
were at work on a Saturday, but I expect with the huge numbers of
dissatisfied customers if they didn't open on Sats they'd have to do
massives of overtime during the week.

Anyway, pause for ten minutes to allow the recorded dolly to run
through all the options, then finally I get to speak to a Real Person,
who, luckily, actually appeared to be human (often they are not; often
they have a very strong accent which makes you wonder whether you
didn't dial the double-glazing company by mistake).

Five minutes later and it was all sorted. I didn't tell the lady that
I was ringing from my dressing gown, as I don't need the Thought
Police around here anytime soon on charges of sexual harassment. But
it ruined my morning as I thought of the bods who write this software
and cavalierly demand 20% here, there and everywhere.

Taxpayers think that anything from HMRC
must be correct and any error must be down to themselves or their
accountant. The notices don't admit the problems and I feel this is
unacceptable. It causes distress and worry to taxpayers and
demonstrates HMRCs cavalier attitude to taxpayers and agents."

Distress, worry, and ANGER! I am still annoyed that the normal course
of my Saturday morning was disturbed by a bunch of incompetents at
HMRC Towers. It's only because I keep *detailed* accounts and have
done so for at least 20 years that I was confident that they'd got it
wrong. I firmly believe the HMRC just try it on, knowing that many
thousands of taxpayers (not me, of course) do not have a clue about
their personal finances and thus do not have a leg to stand on. It's
almost like extortion, really.

MM

On Sun, 24 Jan 2010 09:40:50 +0000, MM wrote:

On Sat, 23 Jan 2010 18:36:08 +0000, Peter Saxton
wrote:

Ignore any coding notices from HMRC until near to the new tax year.....

I couldn't ignore them, for it would have meant that the pension
companies concerned would have started deducting 20% from next month.

Sure I can wait a year, then claim the overpaid tax back, but why
should I bail out the Treasury for the Government's mishandling of the
economy?

MM

Sorry, I was thinking of the general problem regarding 2010-2011.

It looks like the same problems are happening with late 2009-2010
notices.